macmarauder Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Sorry if this comes out as a grip and a rant. But why Ohh why do employers value a degree so much? I went to another interview where everything went great but then he tells me that the only reason he can't hire me is the lack of a programming degree or any useful degree for that matter. I've got more than enough actual experience but I don't have a little pace of pieper (piece of paper) that says that I know what I'm doing. It's like a college degree is the new standard with the same value as a HS diploma. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hitest Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Sorry if this comes out as a grip and a rant. But why Ohh why do employers value a degree so much? I went to another interview where everything went great but then he tells me that the only reason he can't hire me is the lack of a programming degree or any useful degree for that matter. I've got more than enough actual experience but I don't have a little pace of pieper (piece of paper) that says that I know what I'm doing. It's like a college degree is the new standard with the same value as a HS diploma. Hang in there buddy! Something will come your way. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BitBangerUSA Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 got me.i've worked for and with some people who have that piece of paper and some have been very good. others not - one in particular was fond of sharing stories of his time spent in pursuing 'recreational' skills - guess he mis-understood the concept of a 'well-rounded education.'the company/interviewer didn't know beforehand you don't have a degree?shame on them for the non-degree being the reason for not hiring!i suspect that some employers are just being lazy - can't cough up the resources to determine if someone is qualified without that diploma.i feel for you macmarauder - hang in there.i have an interview myself in a few hours, and also have no degree, but lots of experience. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nerelda Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 macmarauder, do you have any certificates then? Did you perhaps bring with you a portfolio with some examples of work you've done? (Do you just have an associates degree, or none at all? Just making sure I didn't misunderstand that part.)Shame on them for not doing their homework before interviewing you. I'm sure you have a big enough list of references to blow most people out of the water! Just because a person has a degree, doesn't mean they have all the needed knowledge or experience. I know several people in my classes who can read the books, study, and get all A's.....but when it comes to actually doing the work, and hands-on stuff, they don't know D*Ck.If they are going to be that stuck up, and not give you some kind of equal opportunity, then to H3LL with them! That company isn't worth it.As hitest already said... Hang in there buddy! Something will come your way. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Matt Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Sorry if this comes out as a grip and a rant. But why Ohh why do employers value a degree so much? I went to another interview where everything went great but then he tells me that the only reason he can't hire me is the lack of a programming degree or any useful degree for that matter. I've got more than enough actual experience but I don't have a little pace of pieper (piece of paper) that says that I know what I'm doing. It's like a college degree is the new standard with the same value as a HS diploma. hey macmarauder, sorry man. That sounds real tough... Are you certified in a programming language? Perhap sif employrs saw that you were (if you are) then things may be different. Hey don't listen to me though - I'm only 14 and have no working experience.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jcl Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Sorry if this comes out as a grip and a rant. But why Ohh why do employers value a degree so much?IMO BitBangerUSA's right, it's laziness. Employers really want a objective, quantitative measurement of ability. When they discover there isn't one, they panic and start looking for anything objective, regardless of what it may mean. The two obvious places to look are education and certification. The fact that neither may correlate with ability is irrelevant. The important thing is that they let the HR department quickly sort of resumes to prioritize interviews. The existence of the measurement is more important than what it measures. Then the measurement becomes a requirement, and you know the rest.It's like a college degree is the new standard with the same value as a HS diploma. It does have the same value as a HS diploma. Have you looked at the sort of people who get HS diplomas? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cowsgonemadd3 Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Boss is nuts that all....lol Work for yourself if possible maybe? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
robroy Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 I understand how you feel, I once did a job for 8 months, after my boss quit to take a better job, I did it without pay raise or thanks then when I applied for the position permanently they told me the same thing. They hired someone with the degree and seven years later he is just barely able to cope with it. I since found another position where my practical skills are appreciated. As everyone else says, Hang in there and something will show upJD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jlwohac Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 Sounds like the place where I work. College degree is a BIG deal here and most of the jobs HAVE to have experience within the plant (a corn wet mill) to make an intelligent decision. I've trained a LOT of people here, and trust me, college degrees aren't what is needed for the job. Willingness to learn and common sense are critical. The lab techs just follow written procedures or are shown how to test the samples and the supervisors, well...they are hired (from outside our plant) without any knowledge of how our system works and then try to make decisions! It can get quite funny at times, now that I think of it. Guess they don't realize that we operators are the ones that make them look good. (Well, maybe they did learn a lesson about the supervisors because the last three they hired were from our plant.) And the engineers keep telling us how stuff "should" work because it all looks good on paper. I just don't understand why industries/companies don't see the potential in people with good work experience. Obviously if a person has the skills required, he or she would be able to learn whatever was necessary to do the job without having a degree.Don't let it get ya down...you know your skills and potential and in time someone else will see it too! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Snaxe Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 You've put into words one reason why I hate school, macmarauder. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
macmarauder Posted September 30, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 I have an associates in computer science engineering but I want to get back into Multimedia Developing or R&D Video Production.I spent half my life infront of a computer making musice videos, writing programs, ect., ect., photoshop, ect., ect., ect., you get the idea and the other half under a car turning wrenches. I'm very antisocial so I never had friends to do stuff with to slow me down, so that is literally spent my whole life that way. My first computer really was an Apple1. It's kinda hard to explain to them what I did in the R&D departments for that deffence contractor and at Apple. Mostly the deffence contractor, they ceriouly gave me a list of what I can say and what I can't. I had one guy that didn't even believe me and thought that I padded my resume. At least until he called Apple and Steve personally called him back. that's how I got the job at the deffence contractor, with out that I wouldn't have gotten it. So once again people look at me as a 23 yr kid trying to get a 40 yrs job.The entire tech market in Colorado Spings sucks. Been like that since before the 911 crash. You can drive down Garden of the Gods RD. and most of the big tech businesses are gone. So a lot of employers here are itchy about risk. I have two places that will hire me in a heartbeat if I had a programing degree so I took a job at Autozone to pay the bills for now and I'm seting up some college classes now. They really like me there. Today was my first day and the old DOS 486 turd computers crashed (all of them and the server). they had been fidling eith them for and hour before I got there. took me 15 min and I had them all up and running. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mikex Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 macsecure some toilet paper to some printer paper, print yourself a nice degree.go for an interview, when asked, give the degre (without printer paper).inform employer that is what the degree is good for when you have a resume such as yours.Be sure to thank them for the interview before security shows up.M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
macmarauder Posted September 30, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 this is all kinda funny because they know already that they can't hire me but they still want to meet me for some reason. I could never figure that out. Ohhh and thank all of you guys for the support and compliments. I just see what others don't, probably because I don't think like others. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jcl Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 this is all kinda funny because they know already that they can't hire me but they still want to meet me for some reason. I could never figure that out.A little dissent in the ranks? It wouldn't surprise me if there were people in the company who thought as much of the policy as you do. Maybe they're hoping to use you as leverage to change things.Or maybe they're just sadists Quote Link to post Share on other sites
robshanahan Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 Many companies (especially large ones) are forced to implement written policies that remove the ability to use common sense and judgement from all levels of employment. They (they being upper management) require different departments (most especially HR) to follow these policies instead of exercising independent thought in order to shield themselves from lawsuits (it doesn't really work, but it does give the company's attorney something concrete to point to if there is a discrimination suit brought against them). It really does come down to more than just laziness. It is also a fear of litigation (which unfortunately is well-founded). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
robroy Posted October 1, 2004 Report Share Posted October 1, 2004 Many companies (especially large ones) are forced to implement written policies that remove the ability to use common sense and judgement from all levels of employment. They (they being upper management) require different departments (most especially HR) to follow these policies instead of exercising independent thought in order to shield themselves from lawsuits (it doesn't really work, but it does give the company's attorney something concrete to point to if there is a discrimination suit brought against them). It really does come down to more than just laziness. It is also a fear of litigation (which unfortunately is well-founded). Got to agree about the fear of litigation, especially when you consider that there are twice the number of attorneys in DC than in the whole of Japan. That one fact give cause for alarm JD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.