Gas Price Talk Radio

[jdallen73]

G'Day everyone.

im new here on these forums but found what you are saying about Gas prices interesting.

I live in England,UK.Luckily,at the moment,i dont drive a car,though i do ride a motorbike.I have had my license for approx year and a half.When i got it,petrol was averaging 0.91p per litre.Now its averaging £1.23p per litre.I know some towns/cities are charging even more.

What with road tax,congestion charges(london) and ever increasing price of petrol,something needs to be done.To make matters worse,the Government are hiking the price of road tax up again in the not so distant future!!

[JDoors]

...To make matters worse,the Government are hiking the price of road tax up again in the not so distant future!!

Of course! Prices are rising, people are feeling the pinch, so ... Raise taxes!

Some people in The States have been advocating drastic tax hikes on gas for years to, among other reasons, lower consumption. Of course the main result of increased costs is to lower consumption for the people who can't afford it any more. Higher gas prices also increases the cost of nearly everything else, and who does that affect the most? The people who can't afford it.

Over here there's one political party that always claims they're "for the poor and middleclass," yet, paradoxically, they're also the party that is famous for answering every question with, "Raise taxes!" Is it just me, or doesn't that adversely affect the poor and middleclass the most?

Ah well, I filled up at $4.20 today. Probably the highest I've paid yet, but still cheaper than you pay (sorry for rubbing that in!).

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Edited July 12, 2008 by JDoors

[Pete_C]

The problem is the rapid rise of the cost of gas and diesel combined with the vastness of the country.

The Rail system has drastically shrunk as reliance on trucks hauling freight over the interstate cut into profits and as a result our Rail system still primarily relies on Diesel locomotives.

Instead of investing on rebuilding our infrastructure we have thrown away three trillion dollars on the war in Iraq and to make matters worse that money was borrowed from the Chinese rather than paid for by raising taxes and the debt continues to rise.

We seriously need new leadership which takes into account what is best for the country and the world, not just their personal agenda and that of their cronies.

The impact of decisions have to be weighed, and Congress needs to step up to the plate and stop being a rubber stamp for bad policies.

We need an energy policy which addresses all aspects of current demand and future use. Just saying we should conserve or we should drill more or build windmills alone is not enough. We need to address the infrastructure, the efficiency of transport systems and supply, alternative sources and resources. We need not just to address automobiles but all aspects of energy use. Shifting to things like plugin electrics without increasing the electric generation and transmission infrastructure is asking for another disaster.

This administration has done an excellent job of puttin the US on a crash course to becoming a third world country with crumbling infrastructure and a populace no longer able to afford what was just a decade ago considered the normal American standard of living.

[Bubba Bob]

I just took a trip to visit family and ironically spent less money in gas than I did at the same time last year, even though gas is $1.50 higher. Did 60mph the whole way instead of my usuall 75-85mph. Pulled of just under 18mpg in my F150. Which, doesn't sounds like much, but It usually gets 12.5mpg...

Who's for cutting the interstate speed limites back to 55mph? For me, slowing down ment 50% better gas milage... However, this old truck is a brick when it comes to wind resistance.

[Honda_Boy]

Ha, I believe my Civic cuts through the air a little better

[Bubba Bob]

Ha, I believe my Civic cuts through the air a little better

Yeah, but you're pulling what, 7k RPM at 85mph?

[Honda_Boy]

Nah, just 4500. I still get 30-32 on the interstate (75-80). It may be spinnin that high but it's only movin 2200lbs.

Passed a station on the way home, 87 - $3.99, 89 - $4.14, 93 - $4.29.

[JDoors]

I just took a trip to visit family and ironically spent less money in gas than I did at the same time last year, even though gas is $1.50 higher. Did 60mph the whole way instead of my usuall 75-85mph. Pulled of just under 18mpg in my F150. Which, doesn't sounds like much, but It usually gets 12.5mpg...

Who's for cutting the interstate speed limites back to 55mph? For me, slowing down ment 50% better gas milage... However, this old truck is a brick when it comes to wind resistance.

I'm against lower limits but, the point about DRIVING slower is an excellent one. I'm trying. Really. But it's a tough habit to break. At least now I don't get impatient when there's a slow driver in front of me. Instead of, "Why the ...?" I think, "I'm savin' gas!"

[Pete_C]

I just took a trip to visit family and ironically spent less money in gas than I did at the same time last year, even though gas is $1.50 higher. Did 60mph the whole way instead of my usuall 75-85mph. Pulled of just under 18mpg in my F150. Which, doesn't sounds like much, but It usually gets 12.5mpg...

Who's for cutting the interstate speed limites back to 55mph? For me, slowing down ment 50% better gas milage... However, this old truck is a brick when it comes to wind resistance.

I'm against lower limits but, the point about DRIVING slower is an excellent one. I'm trying. Really. But it's a tough habit to break. At least now I don't get impatient when there's a slow driver in front of me. Instead of, "Why the ...?" I think, "I'm savin' gas!"

I agree; not all vehicles get peak performance at 55MPH (My truck seems to get best mileage at about 70 , not 55. ), what about overdrive , modified performance chips etc; not to mention those whose living depends on travel.

Time is money and they may be willing to pay for the extra gas if it means an extra delivery or service call in the day.

Or consider truckers who are limited to a set number of hours on the road each day. A 10MPH reduction means 80 miles less in a given eight hour day, 20 MPH cuts back 160 miles. Not sure how many hours straight they are allowed to drive, Cherokee Chief can fill us in on that one ; but I bet it makes a big difference on a long haul whether you have to lay over and take three or four days to make the run instead of two.

Sure, you can eek out a few more MPG by keeping it under 55 on most cars; especially overloaded under powered ones. However, there are better ways to increase mileage which I bet few pay attention to. How often do you check your tire pressure. When you bought tires did you ask about the max pressure and rolling resistance / fuel economy of the tire you bought? How often do you go through and remove accumulated items which add to the weight of the vehicle? Do you haul unnecessary weight around? How about banning fat people from driving until they loose weight since it takes more gas to move a heavier person?

No a reduction in the national speed limit is unnecessary and intrusive. Those who wish to slow down can do so.

Side note, the local Bus and Rail system is considering charging for parking at the currently free park and ride facilities since they are full all the time with commuters taking the bus and train system.

Last week I filled up at $3.91, now it is down to $3.81.

Gasand diesel won't last forever, but for now they are the only viable fuel for mass use on automobiles and trucks.

[JDoors]

My knowledge may be out-of-date but most cars are (were) designed to be most efficient at ~40 MPH. You can see the subconscious reaction to this every day, there are a large number of people who drive ~40 regardless of the actual speed limit. It's not that there's some magical human need to drive 40 mph, there's a "sweet spot" that is designed into cars at that speed. Any faster and the engine noticeably strains, slower and the trans begins to "hunt" for the right gear (drops down a gear occasionally). I've always called those people "amoeba brains" because they're not even thinking. One brain cell, one speed, no thought processes in evidence, just driving on instinct.

Just yesterday I mentioned to friends I needed to slow down and one said, "But if you drive faster you'll GET there faster and use less fuel!" I am certain that is not correct, but I let it slide since I don't know the math.

I have to admit I stopped religiously checking tire pressure when gas stations started charging for air. Uh, no. (Though it's a little known fact you can ask the attendant to switch the air on for free, but I'm not willing to take that extra step.) So (I'm ashamed to admit) my tires are only checked when I have the oil changed and ... that's that.

I've never left junk in the trunk except for what I carry around personally, if you know what I mean. Lose weight to save on gas? Ha! Gas'll have to get a lot higher to prod me into dieting.

As for public transportation, I'm not surprised they're charging for stuff that was free before. They have to pay higher fuel costs too (in addition to higher costs related to greater useage of the system). Frankly I AM surprised tickets haven't doubled in price. Yet.

[Pete_C]

Here two cents on every dollar sales tax goes to public transport; but with the economy going down the toilet fast retail sales are decreasing and so is tax revenue. So they have to think fast to come up with new sources of income to cover operating expenses and debt (bonds) payments. They already doubled the fares recently, but fares cover a minimal part of the cost of operations and if they made them cover it all it would still be much cheaper to make car payments, insurance payments and buy premium gas than to ride the bus and train.

[Honda_Boy]

was still $4.29 for 93 Octane when I last filled up. The fuel is 10% Ethanol around here now. I hope that crap don't gunk up my engine. Last tank was about 140 City and 100 interstate miles and I managed to pull off just under 32MPG average. That means my interstate mileage was close to 34 I think. BTW, that's with the engine spinning at over 4000RPMs

Edited July 18, 2008 by Honda_Boy

[JDoors]

Ethanol is a much more active solvent than gasoline, it actually "scours" your system rather than "gunk it up." Cars have been designed for ~10 percent ethanol for at least a decade so your car will be fine. Did they switch to ethanol because of air quality or ... ?

Looks like the cheap stuff here is around $4.20 and stuck there.

[Honda_Boy]

I have no idea why here they changed. Where I live, there isn't even emissions testing because the population isn't large enough (which is good cause I kinda doubt my car can pass).

[JDoors]

I'm out in what used to be the sticks. When I moved here there was no emissions testing. Then the population exploded and once the air quality reached a certain level of stinkiness emissions testing became required, AND everybody changed to 10% ethanol -- for air quality, they say. So if you're still rural it's gotta be somethin' else. It's cheaper for the refineries, I think, but ONLY due to tax subsidies, that ought to be reason enough for them to make the switch.

Even when I had a junker it passed emissions tests, they must not be that tough. My impression is that if it runs OK it'll pass. If it's coughing and sputtering, probably not.

I've never heard of any problems with 10% ethanol gas. At least not with cars that aren't considered antiques, and even those can be upgraded to accept it (for example, change hoses and seals, ethanol could "attack" older types).

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Edited July 20, 2008 by JDoors

[Bubba Bob]

I'm out in what used to be the sticks. When I moved here there was no emissions testing. Then the population exploded and once the air quality reached a certain level of stinkiness emissions testing became required, AND everybody changed to 10% ethanol -- for air quality, they say. So if you're still rural it's gotta be somethin' else. It's cheaper for the refineries, I think, but ONLY due to tax subsidies, that ought to be reason enough for them to make the switch.

Even when I had a junker it passed emissions tests, they must not be that tough. My impression is that if it runs OK it'll pass. If it's coughing and sputtering, probably not.

I've never heard of any problems with 10% ethanol gas. At least not with cars that aren't considered antiques, and even those can be upgraded to accept it (for example, change hoses and seals, ethanol could "attack" older types).

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10% Ethanol won't attack hoses. Too small in quantity. It will however lower your gas milage. Ive noticed all the cheap gas stations, and Walmart, around here have E10 while the Chevron/Shell/Exxons don't. So, by getting the cheap gas, you're actualling paying more per mile driven. Ive tried to explain that to friends and family, but all they say is "Well, my car runs fine". Gahh!!

[Honda_Boy]

Actually since my car is OBD2 it will fail automatically for having a CEL. OBD0, and OBD1 cars only have to pass a sniffer test in the exhaust (which I might even fail that) but if your car is OBD2 (pretty much anything 96+ and some 95 which I have a 99 motor and ECU in a 96 car) it has to pass both a diagnostic and sniffer test. My car would fail automatically for throwing a code 91 CEL.

[TheTerrorist_75]

E10 would need to cost approximately .90 less per gallon, than gas of equal octane, to match mileage costs.

If I can travel 576 miles on a tank of 91 octane at $4.25 while getting 18 m.p.g., but only 448 miles on a tank of E10, averaging about 4 m.p.g. less, it would need to cost about $3.31 for a gallon of E10.

I think I'll pay for the regular gas.

[Pete_C]

E10 would need to cost approximately .90 less per gallon, than gas of equal octane, to match mileage costs.

If I can travel 576 miles on a tank of 91 octane at $4.25 while getting 18 m.p.g., but only 448 miles on a tank of E10, averaging about 4 m.p.g. less, it would need to cost about $3.31 for a gallon of E10.

I think I'll pay for the regular gas.

I wish they gave us that option

Here even the big boys all have the "Contains 10% Ethanol" sticker on the pumps. I found one station which still sold the good stuff, but after a couple months even they succumbed.

I got 20% better mileage with real gas compared to E10.

[bobbynichols]

$ 4.269 ( that .009 always cracks me up ) / gallon for low test using debit card. ($4.219 Cash)

Don'sha just love getting that extra 'ding' when using credit/debit ?

[JDoors]

$ 4.269 ...

That's kinda surprising 'cause it's dropped below $4.00 'round here. Now I can afford that Hummer!

[Honda_Boy]

drove past a station today that had Premium for $4.11 so gas is goin down. I forgot to reset my dern tripodometer every time I filled up this weekend at Import Alliance so I won't be too sure on my mileage. I think last time I only drove about 5-10 miles without resetting it.

[sultan_emerr]

Would it help to switch the ethanol subsidies from corn to sugarcane and Saw Grass?

[Pete_C]

Would it help to switch the ethanol subsidies from corn to sugarcane and Saw Grass?

It would help to get rid of the ethanol mandates the Bush Administration invoked.

Short of that, yes it would help food prices if the feds did not pay subsidies (what is it $1 a gallon to oil companies which blend ethanol in their gas?) for using feed corn , and instead subsidised efforts to generate cellulosic ethanol and dropped the import levies against Brazillian Ethanol from sugar cane.

Here the paper listed the low price (two stations, Costco and Seven Eleven) at $3.64 per gallon. I saw it a couple days ago at $3.82 .

In fact http://www.dallasgasprices.com/ lists a whole page in the $3.64-$3.67 range

Hope it keeps dropping or at least stays that low until I need to fill up again.

[JDoors]

Just great. Prices are dropping, but since it's the beginning of the month I fill 'er up with Premium @ $4.19.

Re: Ethanol. We've known for decades that we HAVE to wean ourselves off gasoline, yet when we finally start to do it, people complain 'cause it's expensive. Meh.