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[hitest]

Hmmmm, for being the n00best "expert" on the board, I'm pretty happy with myself managing to install gentoo on the first shot (with the exception of configuring xorg properly, but a very easy fix thanks to iccaros)...Since it was just a POS test box, I had no real reason to keep the install...I really didn't think there was anything special about portage....maybe I'm not getting the inner workings but emerge <your app of choice> doesn't seem much different than apt-get install <your app of choice>

It did teach me quite a bit about linux and partitioning in general but I don't feel like I'm missing anything by using Ubuntu and Debian.

For now Debian is my distro of choice, it runs really lean and fast, and just works once you set it up, as you know

hitest,

I have to agree. Debian Sid is by far the fastest distro I've run so far...Booting up is a record breaker and both KDE and Gnome are very fast as well as my NFS networking (Ubuntu usually takes a minute or so to find the shares, Deb finds em' instantly).

The "just works" takes a little knowledge (sad to say, a bit more knowledge than I have for a couple issues) but it's do-able.

I can't say if I'll stick with Debian since this install was just because I was bored and waiting for Dapper but so far everything is stable...not bad for something labeled as unstable.

And to stick with the thread:

Same Debian Sid with KDE3.5

To t0c: Nice screenshot, t0c!! Dangerous vampire babes, ya gotta love that, heh-heh.

Yes, I also really like the fast boot-up time for Debian. I'm keeping Debian for now.......until Dapper is released then I may get that.

I will of course try out the next version of Slackware when it is released, I think a new one should come soon perhaps. Patrick released 10.2 in September.

My problem is that even if I find something I really like (Debian) I get bored after several months because everything is working properly. I will most likely, maybe, perhaps stick with Debian for the next little while, lol.

To Carnevil: Yeah, I might go back and try Gentoo again (probably not), but, I do like Slack and Debian. I wonder what the new Slackware will look like? Debian rocks...................................for now:-)

[Carnevil]

I really didn't think there was anything special about portage....maybe I'm not getting the inner workings but emerge <your app of choice> doesn't seem much different than apt-get install <your app of choice>

Emerge KDE or GNOME. The differentness will start to sink in ten or twelve hours into the build. Especially if the build fails.

Gotta love the twelve hour builds, maybe it's just my perception of time, but ports seems to build things faster. Like KDE, with the exact same system gentoo took about twelve hours to build, FreeBSD was about 4-6 hours. It took me 2 hours to build firefox on gentoo, that was annoying. Apt-get would be more like pkg_add or even pkgsrc.

[iccaros]

I really didn't think there was anything special about portage....maybe I'm not getting the inner workings but emerge <your app of choice> doesn't seem much different than apt-get install <your app of choice>

Emerge KDE or GNOME. The differentness will start to sink in ten or twelve hours into the build. Especially if the build fails.

Gotta love the twelve hour builds, maybe it's just my perception of time, but ports seems to build things faster. Like KDE, with the exact same system gentoo took about twelve hours to build, FreeBSD was about 4-6 hours. It took me 2 hours to build firefox on gentoo, that was annoying. Apt-get would be more like pkg_add or even pkgsrc.

hmm. Thats funny, I can build a gentoo system with KDE in about 6 hours from the ground up. I have found that what you put in make.conf if everything..

These settings were set by the catalyst build script that automatically built this stage

# Please consult /etc/make.conf.example for a more detailed example

CFLAGS="-O2 -mcpu=pentium4 -fforce-addr -funroll-loops -fprefetch-loop-arrays -falign-functions=4 -mmmx -msse -msse2 -mfpmath=sse -pipe"

CHOST="i686-pc-linux-gnu"

CXXFLAGS="${CFLAGS}"

MAKEOPTS="-j3"

PORTDIR_OVERLAY="/usr/local/portage"

USE="-doc hal pic unicode dvdr cdparanoia wxwindows dvdread dvdwrite a52 avi mad dvd audiofile aac win32codecs sndfile ffmpeg xv divx4linux dv encode fame mpeg ogg quicktime subtitles vorbis xvid doc libusb cups foomaticdb ppds and usb scanner opengl java python perl mozilla alsa X sse sse2 mysql -gnome gkt gtk2 qt kde dvdrw cdr mmx tcltk ati ipw2100 "

but like every thing else.. here is my experiance..

ubuntu -- I break it in 20 min tring to do advanced things liek add webmin (try to remove it.. your apt will be dead untill you reinstall the system)

suse-- -well lets just say I don't like the feel..

slackware.. love it.. when I want a system up fast and working... but not nessarly bleeding edge..

bsd (you name it) great for fast small installs that are rock solid..

my servers go like this..

vmware server -- gentooo -- I get 2 to 3 more sessions with gentoo then other distros.. (I run windows term server inside) on Sun sunFire V40 dual core

email/web/firewall bsd

samba/printers/nfs Red Hat AS4

Sun Ray session server -- ubuntu

also for those who don't knwo you can also emerge a binary version in getnoo so you don't have to compile..

I use everything,, just feel most comfertable with gentoo..

[jcl]

CFLAGS="-O2 -mcpu=pentium4 -fforce-addr -funroll-loops -fprefetch-loop-arrays -falign-functions=4 -mmmx -msse -msse2 -mfpmath=sse -pipe"

CFLAGS!

• -mcpu=pentium4 is almost identical to -march=i386.
  
• -fforce-addr doesn't have any noticable affect IME. (It also seems like a bad idea given the register situation on IA-32 but it might work for the P4.)
  
• -funroll-loops. You're just asking for it
  
• -fprefetch-loop-arrays has always produced slower code for me. I don't think GCC is smart enough to be trusted here.
  
• -falign* should be unnecessary.
  
• -mmmx -msse -msse2 should be handled by the matching USE flags. (The inability of the Gentoo community to RTFM to determine what these flags do was one reason I gave up on it.)
  

Compiler flags suck. (Speaking of things Microsoft got right....)

Edited March 26, 2006 by jcl

[shanenin]

I don't use gentoo to optimize everything. I just use the defualt cflags. I like it mainly because......not really sure. I think I am just used to it. It does everything I need or want, it has not let me down. I have not felt any need to look somewhere else.

[hitest]

Debian Etch, KDE 3.5.1...................... I think I'll keep this distro for awhile.

[Carnevil]

I really didn't think there was anything special about portage....maybe I'm not getting the inner workings but emerge <your app of choice> doesn't seem much different than apt-get install <your app of choice>

Emerge KDE or GNOME. The differentness will start to sink in ten or twelve hours into the build. Especially if the build fails.

Gotta love the twelve hour builds, maybe it's just my perception of time, but ports seems to build things faster. Like KDE, with the exact same system gentoo took about twelve hours to build, FreeBSD was about 4-6 hours. It took me 2 hours to build firefox on gentoo, that was annoying. Apt-get would be more like pkg_add or even pkgsrc.

hmm. Thats funny, I can build a gentoo system with KDE in about 6 hours from the ground up. I have found that what you put in make.conf if everything..

These settings were set by the catalyst build script that automatically built this stage

# Please consult /etc/make.conf.example for a more detailed example

CFLAGS="-O2 -mcpu=pentium4 -fforce-addr -funroll-loops -fprefetch-loop-arrays -falign-functions=4 -mmmx -msse -msse2 -mfpmath=sse -pipe"

CHOST="i686-pc-linux-gnu"

CXXFLAGS="${CFLAGS}"

MAKEOPTS="-j3"

PORTDIR_OVERLAY="/usr/local/portage"

USE="-doc hal pic unicode dvdr cdparanoia wxwindows dvdread dvdwrite a52 avi mad dvd audiofile aac win32codecs sndfile ffmpeg xv divx4linux dv encode fame mpeg ogg quicktime subtitles vorbis xvid doc libusb cups foomaticdb ppds and usb scanner opengl java python perl mozilla alsa X sse sse2 mysql -gnome gkt gtk2 qt kde dvdrw cdr mmx tcltk ati ipw2100 "

So all that makes it compile faster? Isn't that kind of like putting a carbon fiber hood, and a six foot wing on a Honda Civic. But since were talking about make.conf files I should probably show you mine.

CFLAGS= -O -pipe
NO_PROFILE= true		# Avoid compiling profiled libraries
# added by use.perl 2006-03-18 03:50:41
PERL_VER=5.8.8
PERL_VERSION=5.8.8

[jcl]

So all that makes it compile faster?

-O2 slows the compile down a bit compared to -O. Maybe more than a bit. The others options shouldn't have a significant effect.

The relative slowless of Gentoo builds compared to the BSDs is probably a side-effect of the more aggressive optimizations used by Gentoo users. GCC has never been particularly fast (g++ especially was terribly slow until recently) and it can get seriously bogged down if you flip the wrong switches and twist the knobs to far.

And since everyone is doing it, if I remember correctly the last set of CFLAGS I used on Gentoo was

CFLAGS="-O2 -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer -march=athlon-xp -maccumulate-outgoing-args -mieee-fp"

(That should not be interpreted as an endorsement for -maccumulate-outgoing-args or -mieee-fp. They were included for religious reasons.)

Edited March 26, 2006 by jcl

[iccaros]

I really didn't think there was anything special about portage....maybe I'm not getting the inner workings but emerge <your app of choice> doesn't seem much different than apt-get install <your app of choice>

Emerge KDE or GNOME. The differentness will start to sink in ten or twelve hours into the build. Especially if the build fails.

Gotta love the twelve hour builds, maybe it's just my perception of time, but ports seems to build things faster. Like KDE, with the exact same system gentoo took about twelve hours to build, FreeBSD was about 4-6 hours. It took me 2 hours to build firefox on gentoo, that was annoying. Apt-get would be more like pkg_add or even pkgsrc.

hmm. Thats funny, I can build a gentoo system with KDE in about 6 hours from the ground up. I have found that what you put in make.conf if everything..

These settings were set by the catalyst build script that automatically built this stage

# Please consult /etc/make.conf.example for a more detailed example

CFLAGS="-O2 -mcpu=pentium4 -fforce-addr -funroll-loops -fprefetch-loop-arrays -falign-functions=4 -mmmx -msse -msse2 -mfpmath=sse -pipe"

CHOST="i686-pc-linux-gnu"

CXXFLAGS="${CFLAGS}"

MAKEOPTS="-j3"

PORTDIR_OVERLAY="/usr/local/portage"

USE="-doc hal pic unicode dvdr cdparanoia wxwindows dvdread dvdwrite a52 avi mad dvd audiofile aac win32codecs sndfile ffmpeg xv divx4linux dv encode fame mpeg ogg quicktime subtitles vorbis xvid doc libusb cups foomaticdb ppds and usb scanner opengl java python perl mozilla alsa X sse sse2 mysql -gnome gkt gtk2 qt kde dvdrw cdr mmx tcltk ati ipw2100 "

So all that makes it compile faster? Isn't that kind of like putting a carbon fiber hood, and a six foot wing on a Honda Civic. But since were talking about make.conf files I should probably show you mine.

CFLAGS= -O -pipe
NO_PROFILE= true		# Avoid compiling profiled libraries
# added by use.perl 2006-03-18 03:50:41
PERL_VER=5.8.8
PERL_VERSION=5.8.8

na, I like the analagy though..

but the MAKEOPTS="-j3" tells the system to do 3 compiles at a time.. I now also have a cheet (works easly on any gcc system) that is DISTCC, where I have 3 xboxes running GentooX and do distributed compiling..

gentoo with kde last night in 2 1/2 hours.., in VMware..

but I like all the Unix's, so I'm not religious about what versions people use, unless its SCO or Linsprie but then I guess that is religious..

[hitest]

but I like all the Unix's, so I'm not religious about what versions people use, unless its SCO or Linsprie but then I guess that is religious..

I think I belong to your church, iccaros! SCO and Linspire are evil indeed:-)

Here's my favourite distro. Slackware 10.2 running KDE.

Slackware with default settings is fast, lean and mean. I can't wait fo the next version of slack; it should be released soon.

[Carnevil]

So all that makes it compile faster?

-O2 slows the compile down a bit compared to -O. Maybe more than a bit. The others options shouldn't have a significant effect.

The relative slowless of Gentoo builds compared to the BSDs is probably a side-effect of the more aggressive optimizations used by Gentoo users. GCC has never been particularly fast (g++ especially was terribly slow until recently) and it can get seriously bogged down if you flip the wrong switches and twist the knobs to far.

Wasn't GCC4 suppose to speed things up? I never understood all the optimizations used by the gentoo community. It's funny every now and then somebody will show up on the FreeBSD mailing lists with a buildworld problem. Somebody always asks them for their make.conf file, and always it's full of stuff they don't need. You can almost tell they just stepped off the gentoo train. After the person tells them to remove almost all of the stuff, the OP always comes back with "hey it worked".

[Dragon]

my latest install, DamnSmallLinux using Fluxbox. all programs I need installed. This is a Debian install using the Woody repos. This is actually installed on my hdd, not using the livecd version

[hitest]

my latest install, DamnSmallLinux using Fluxbox. all programs I need installed. This is a Debian install using the Woody repos. This is actually installed on my hdd, not using the livecd version

Cool, very nce.

I've been wanting to try out DSL for some time. I've got an old Pll 266 that would just rip with DSL. That would be fun:-)

[Dragon]

my latest install, DamnSmallLinux using Fluxbox. all programs I need installed. This is a Debian install using the Woody repos. This is actually installed on my hdd, not using the livecd version

Cool, very nce.

I've been wanting to try out DSL for some time. I've got an old Pll 266 that would just rip with DSL. That would be fun:-)

in the image, if you enlarge it enough, you can actually see the specs of disk space avialable and used. I have a 5gig hdd, and after partioning, installing, and adding programs, I still have 3.2 gig avialable. When I did the partition, I made my swap 1 gig in size, and then I have almost 800mb still free on my hdd should I decide to make a fat32 swap space.

[hitest]

my latest install, DamnSmallLinux using Fluxbox. all programs I need installed. This is a Debian install using the Woody repos. This is actually installed on my hdd, not using the livecd version

Cool, very nce.

I've been wanting to try out DSL for some time. I've got an old Pll 266 that would just rip with DSL. That would be fun:-)

in the image, if you enlarge it enough, you can actually see the specs of disk space avialable and used. I have a 5gig hdd, and after partioning, installing, and adding programs, I still have 3.2 gig avialable. When I did the partition, I made my swap 1 gig in size, and then I have almost 800mb still free on my hdd should I decide to make a fat32 swap space.

Looks good, your system is running lean and fast. You're a big fan of Debian based distros (Ubuntu, DSL) why not try the real thing?

Debian Etch, the testing version of Debian is very stable I've had no negative issues with it. Debian has the same package managment system as Ubuntu, but, it runs a lot faster than Ubuntu, uses less swap.

I used the netinstall iso that is available at debian.org to set-up my Debian boxes. The Debian install is virtually the same as Ubuntu with one exception. During the install you're required to set-up a mail transfer agent. Just select the top value using SMTP to send and receive mail through your ISP. The netinstall gets you to select a host to download all of your files, not a big deal.

You can download the netinstall iso here, it is small about 100 MB.

Debian Etch- Net install ISO

I've run just about every distro under the sun except Gentoo and I am sold on Debian...it rocks. I like Debian as much as Slackware.................well almost as much as slack:-)

This post made using Debian Etch:-)

[Carnevil]

I had to post this one, because the A-Team f****** rules

[Dragon]

my latest install, DamnSmallLinux using Fluxbox. all programs I need installed. This is a Debian install using the Woody repos. This is actually installed on my hdd, not using the livecd version

Cool, very nce.

I've been wanting to try out DSL for some time. I've got an old Pll 266 that would just rip with DSL. That would be fun:-)

in the image, if you enlarge it enough, you can actually see the specs of disk space avialable and used. I have a 5gig hdd, and after partioning, installing, and adding programs, I still have 3.2 gig avialable. When I did the partition, I made my swap 1 gig in size, and then I have almost 800mb still free on my hdd should I decide to make a fat32 swap space.

Looks good, your system is running lean and fast. You're a big fan of Debian based distros (Ubuntu, DSL) why not try the real thing?

Debian Etch, the testing version of Debian is very stable I've had no negative issues with it. Debian has the same package managment system as Ubuntu, but, it runs a lot faster than Ubuntu, uses less swap.

I used the netinstall iso that is available at debian.org to set-up my Debian boxes. The Debian install is virtually the same as Ubuntu with one exception. During the install you're required to set-up a mail transfer agent. Just select the top value using SMTP to send and receive mail through your ISP. The netinstall gets you to select a host to download all of your files, not a big deal.

You can download the netinstall iso here, it is small about 100 MB.

Debian Etch- Net install ISO

I've run just about every distro under the sun except Gentoo and I am sold on Debian...it rocks. I like Debian as much as Slackware.................well almost as much as slack:-)

This post made using Debian Etch:-)

well I went ahead and downloaded Etch, couldn't use it. 2.6.15, which is the same one Ubuntu uses, Kernel for standard install stops my mouse from working, and I really don't feel like compiling a new kernel right now. tried to do the 2.4 kernel install and their netinstall mirrors would not be able to connect 99% of the time. I was gettin that with the 2.6 Kernel install also.

[hitest]

well I went ahead and downloaded Etch, couldn't use it. 2.6.15, which is the same one Ubuntu uses, Kernel for standard install stops my mouse from working, and I really don't feel like compiling a new kernel right now. tried to do the 2.4 kernel install and their netinstall mirrors would not be able to connect 99% of the time. I was gettin that with the 2.6 Kernel install also.

Bummer, that's a drag! Yes, I remember you said you had issues with your mouse before. For me if hardware doesn't work in Linux I'll replace it with something that does. Perhaps buy a cheap mechanical mouse that'll work and keep your optical as a spare?

I really think you would like Debian.

[hitest]

Slackware Linux

[Dragon]

well I went ahead and downloaded Etch, couldn't use it. 2.6.15, which is the same one Ubuntu uses, Kernel for standard install stops my mouse from working, and I really don't feel like compiling a new kernel right now. tried to do the 2.4 kernel install and their netinstall mirrors would not be able to connect 99% of the time. I was gettin that with the 2.6 Kernel install also.

Bummer, that's a drag! Yes, I remember you said you had issues with your mouse before. For me if hardware doesn't work in Linux I'll replace it with something that does. Perhaps buy a cheap mechanical mouse that'll work and keep your optical as a spare?

I really think you would like Debian.

so far I like all the Debian based distro, I might download Sarge later and give that a try. who knows

Or I might jsut say the heck with it and create my own Debian based Distro, lightweight, yet easily used by a newbie.

[hitest]

so far I like all the Debian based distro, I might download Sarge later and give that a try. who knows

Or I might jsut say the heck with it and create my own Debian based Distro, lightweight, yet easily used by a newbie.

Yes, agreed! I like all of the Debian based distros as well. Good idea, maybe sarge will support your mouse! I've run sarge before it is a nice distro. A light and fast easily installed Debian based distro would be great:-)

If you write it, that would be cool.

[shanenin]

well I went ahead and downloaded Etch, couldn't use it. 2.6.15, which is the same one Ubuntu uses, Kernel for standard install stops my mouse from working, and I really don't feel like compiling a new kernel right now.

what option in the kernel did you have to enable to make the mouse work?

[Dragon]

The way Debian/Ubuntu has it set up made /dev/psaux an empty module, basically it was a module that wasn't configured correctly, or they did some of their own tweaking of the module, I dunno, I do know when I did my Kernel compilation, it worked right off the bat. Mouse never glitched or anything. I sent a copy of my Kernel to Debian for inclusion in the repos, but I don't know if they will use it. mainly because I removed all Bluetooth compatability from it which they seem really hip on shoving down everyones throats at the moment.

Right Now I'm running DSL on my HDD, space reasons, but I might just go ahead and d/l Debian Sarge, then compile a new kernel for it, or like I said earlier, I may just do a Linux from Scratch and build my own distro if you will.

[hitest]

Slackware Linux

[hitest]

Debian Etch Linux.