Dell's Upcoming Linux Offering

[hitest]

Dell+Linux will soon be a reality.

linkage

[deaf_girl]

Second nail in Microsoft's coffin.

First being Vista

[Carnevil]

Second nail in Microsoft's coffin.

First being Vista

This is far from being a nail in Microsoft's coffin. This will still only interest linux people, you won't see some mass exodus from Windows because of this.

It's nice, but remember there's alot of people who uses Windows and don't have a problem with it. I'd never get my family to switch to linux because they're happy with Windows and don't have any problems running it. As much as I love *nix it isn't the right OS for alot of people, atleast not right now. It would be nice if linux could have the easy of use and hardware support of Windows, but it doesn't. Most people just want to turn on their computer and not worry about setting them up. Even if they have to set them up Windows makes it alot easier than *nix. If I throw in an ATI graphics card it won't run as good as it does on Windows. That's not linux's fault but it doesn't matter. People know that if they buy almost any hardware it'll most certainly run on Windows, the same can't be said about *nix. As far as linux has come it still doesn't have the support that Windows or even OSX have.

Edited May 22, 2007 by Carnevil

[deaf_girl]

Don't get me wrong, I love XP. But after 6yrs and $6 billion in R&D, Microsoft has released a bloated, unfinished and limited compatible product. Instead of coming out with 6 different versions for hundreds of dollars, when they should have made a stable usable Home or Pro versions. It will take years for businesses to be able to integrated with their company programs. Where I work, people who have bought new laptops, have so many problems, that they end up having to wait to use a workstation in the office.

I agree with you that Linux isn't the most user friendly. But if they get their "stuff" together and making it more standardized, in 5-10yrs Linux could take over.

[garmanma]

I think ( I hope ) if Dell is sucsessful, that more hardware vendors will get off their duffs and provide Linux drivers

Mark

[iccaros]

But if they get their "stuff" together and making it more standardized,

who make it more standardized? or do you standard across distributions.. which will never happen, too many opinions.

Windows its own standard(they even rebelled against ISO standards), Linux in most cases follows the RFC's and other international standards.

The biggest Issue is hardware, in that case it with hardware that does not follow the standards. or there is no standard.

I know people do not care when its the Hardware and not the OS, but we can vote with our money. I only buy hardware if they support Open Source or at least have a driver. This is hurting me in my recording studio as I believe that MOTU is the best Money can buy for audio cards, but they refuse to support Linux, even though I use a Mac for the studio, I still will not buy their equipment. It's only this stand, that will get companies to do the right thing.

a note for companies, if you release your driver to the Kernel team, they will keep it up to date with the Kernel, you just need to submit changes on what changed on different versions of the hardware. and don't use Binary blobs so others like BSD (insert Version or OS here) can easily, take the driver and create their own driver, with out it costing you a dime.

also you only have to support one version of Linux if you release source code. Like pick Red Hat or SUSE or Ubuntu and release the source, the rest will compile the source on their own.

Edited May 24, 2007 by iccaros

[Bubba Bob]

How much money are we lookign at here? Do we get a discount for using Linux instead of Windows? If not, Id rather order a computer with Windows, if nothing else than for the License, then install Linux myself.

[hitest]

How much money are we lookign at here? Do we get a discount for using Linux instead of Windows? If not, Id rather order a computer with Windows, if nothing else than for the License, then install Linux myself.

According to the Dell site you won't save any money with the Linux version. In fact the windows version may be a bit cheaper.

I'm like iccaros; I'll only buy hardware if it has Linux drivers.

That will sometimes narrow my buying options, but, I believe in and support FOSS (free open source software).

[shanenin]

In fact the windows version may be a bit cheaper.

I appreciate what Dell is doing, but it is ridiculous to pay more for less.

[hitest]

In fact the windows version may be a bit cheaper.

I appreciate what Dell is doing, but it is ridiculous to pay more for less.

Agreed.

[deaf_girl]

But if they get their "stuff" together and making it more standardized,

who make it more standardized? or do you standard across distributions.. which will never happen, too many opinions.

Windows its own standard(they even rebelled against ISO standards), Linux in most cases follows the RFC's and other international standards.

The biggest Issue is hardware, in that case it with hardware that does not follow the standards. or there is no standard.

I know people do not care when its the Hardware and not the OS, but we can vote with our money. I only buy hardware if they support Open Source or at least have a driver. This is hurting me in my recording studio as I believe that MOTU is the best Money can buy for audio cards, but they refuse to support Linux, even though I use a Mac for the studio, I still will not buy their equipment. It's only this stand, that will get companies to do the right thing.

a note for companies, if you release your driver to the Kernel team, they will keep it up to date with the Kernel, you just need to submit changes on what changed on different versions of the hardware. and don't use Binary blobs so others like BSD (insert Version or OS here) can easily, take the driver and create their own driver, with out it costing you a dime.

also you only have to support one version of Linux if you release source code. Like pick Red Hat or SUSE or Ubuntu and release the source, the rest will compile the source on their own.

Merger of Linux

http://www.linux-foundation.org/wordpress/?p=286

[Carnevil]

How much money are we lookign at here? Do we get a discount for using Linux instead of Windows? If not, Id rather order a computer with Windows, if nothing else than for the License, then install Linux myself.

I'm like iccaros; I'll only buy hardware if it has Linux drivers.

That will sometimes narrow my buying options, but, I believe in and support FOSS (free open source software).

Agreed, I specifically buy what I know will run both linux and FreeBSD. It's one of the reasons I stick with Nvidia for my graphics card. Yeah I know ATI has drivers but they SUCK.

[shanenin]

For that reason I to refuse to buy an ati card, even if it will just be used on my windows box.

[iccaros]

http://www.linux-foundation.org/wordpress/?p=286

Marketing Crap, Linux already has standards that the Major Distributions hold to, the LSB http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_Standard_Base, fails because it says all Distribution will be able to use RPM's, but being able to use RPM's and being able to install complex applications with RPM's is totally different.

take Gentoo, Slackware and Debian. None are Commercial releases and none can truly meet this standard with out destroying what makes these distributions great. While Alien will let you install RPM's on Debian and you can install RPM's on Gentoo and Slackware, they use different init scripts and locations. Meaning that once installed the user would have to copy files over to different places to run correctly.

The only real way is to Document the install process so that developers of these system scan wrap the installer. Btu software Companies do not want to do this.

Gentoo is setup to install from source

Debian does a tight control of packages and what it installs and where to help protect the system

and Slackware just uses a tar system to untar the files.

and this still leaves out BSD, which is not helpful for most of us.

no Linux as a "Standard" is not something you really want. what we really want is for software developers to stick to ISO and POSIX standards, to use OPENGL instead of Direct X and to pick one distribution and document how the software installs, so the other distributions can wrap the installer.

or better yet, Codeweavers were able to create an installer that works on all *nix machines, so its not that hard.

what the LSB is really trying to do, is put the Linux development in the hands of Companies, and out of the hands of Open Source developers.

[hitest]

http://www.linux-foundation.org/wordpress/?p=286

Marketing Crap, Linux already has standards that the Major Distributions hold to, the LSB http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_Standard_Base, fails because it says all Distribution will be able to use RPM's, but being able to use RPM's and being able to install complex applications with RPM's is totally different.

take Gentoo, Slackware and Debian. None are Commercial releases and none can truly meet this standard with out destroying what makes these distributions great. While Alien will let you install RPM's on Debian and you can install RPM's on Gentoo and Slackware, they use different init scripts and locations. Meaning that once installed the user would have to copy files over to different places to run correctly.

The only real way is to Document the install process so that developers of these system scan wrap the installer. Btu software Companies do not want to do this.

Gentoo is setup to install from source

Debian does a tight control of packages and what it installs and where to help protect the system

and Slackware just uses a tar system to untar the files.

and this still leaves out BSD, which is not helpful for most of us.

no Linux as a "Standard" is not something you really want. what we really want is for software developers to stick to ISO and POSIX standards, to use OPENGL instead of Direct X and to pick one distribution and document how the software installs, so the other distributions can wrap the installer.

or better yet, Codeweavers were able to create an installer that works on all *nix machines, so its not that hard.

what the LSB is really trying to do, is put the Linux development in the hands of Companies, and out of the hands of Open Source developers.

Oh man, right on dude!

Thank you for sticking up for my three favourite distros: Slackware, Debian, FreeBSD! Let us leave the fate of Linux/Unix in the hands of the people we trust, the open source developers:-) I'm thrilled that Dell is getting into Linux. But, I want Linux to stay true to itself. That is, let it evolve naturally in a free open source environment.

[hitest]

It is official, here are the Linux offerings from Dell.

http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS5465909777.html

[iccaros]

Wow Dell is expensive, while the base line model looks good I priced out at $1,858

for the following

# 1505N


	Date	 	5/25/2007 10:29:03 AM Central Standard Time
	Catalog Number	 	29 Retail 19
	Catalog Number / Description	 	Product Code	 	SKU	 	Id
	Inspiron E1505:
Intel® Core™ 2 Duo processor T7200 (4MB Cache/2.00GHz/667MHz FSB)	 	KLM2HN	 	[223-0455]	 	1
	Operating System:
Ubuntu Edition version 7.04	 	LINXUX	 	[420-7153]	 	11
	LCD Panel:
15.4 inch UltraSharpâ„¢ Wide Screen SXGA+ Display with TrueLifeâ„¢	 	15SXGAS	 	[320-4652]	 	2
	Memory:
2GB DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHZ, 2 DIMM	 	2G2D6	 	[311-7357]	 	3
	Hard Drive:
100GB 7200rpm SATA Hard Drive	 	100GB72	 	[341-3112]	 	8
	CD ROM/DVD ROM:
8X CD/DVD Burner (DVD+/-RW) with double-layer DVD+R write capability	 	8XLDVDR	 	[313-3959]	 	16
	Video Card:
Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 950	 	INTLVID	 	[320-5630]	 	6
	Sound Options:
Integrated Audio	 	IS	 	[313-4217]	 	17
	Processor Branding:
Intel Centrino Core Duo Processor	 	ICNDNB	 	[310-8314]	 	749
	Primary Battery:
85 WHr 9-cell Lithium Ion Primary Battery	 	9BAT	 	[312-0403]	 	27
	Additional Power Adapter:
Dell Additional Slim 65W Auto/Air/AC Adapter	 	ASAAADT	 	[310-8940]	 	57
	Wireless Networking Cards:
Intel PRO/Wireless 3945a/g	 	IP3945	 	[430-1918]	 	19
	Warranty and Service:
3Yr In-Home Service, Parts + Labor - Next Day	 	SQ3OS	 	[412-0359][950-3339][950-5442][960-2780][960-5952][980-2890][985-3598][985-3609]	 	29
	Protect Against Accidents:
Add CompleteCare Accidental Damage Service to 3Yr Lim Warranty	 	CCADP3	 	[412-0358][960-9188]	 	33
	Environmental Options:
Recycling Kit and Plant a Tree for Me	 	RCLTREE	 	[310-5408][466-1830]	 	129
[\code]


to compare
 $1,800 for an equally equiped Macbook (smaller screen on the macbook, but i like the smaller screen for Airline Travel. )

I only say expensive because the Dell is really cheaply made. I have a Dell laptop D620 and a Macbook and the difference is night and day on quality. plus the Macbook comes with everything I had to add to the dell except the Ram size and the extended Warranty.  Plus with the Macbook you can run OS X, Linux and Windows with the dell its just linux and windows..


macbook specs
[code]
# 2.16GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
# 2GB 667 DDR2 SDRAM - 2x1GB
# 120GB Serial ATA @ 5400 rpm
# SuperDrive 8x (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
# Apple Mini-DVI to DVI Adapter
# Keyboard/Mac OS - U.S. English
# MagSafe Airline Adapter
# AppleCare Protection Plan for MacBook/iBook - Auto-enroll
# AirPort Extreme Card & Bluetooth

while I thank Dell for the offer, I don't think price wise they truly compete.

advantages to the dell

faster harddrive

larger screen

shows a market for Linux

Cons

have to add lots of extras to get a decent sytems

no bluetooth

larger screen

apple pros

the default configuration is decent, same cost to add just ram and Warranty

better quality hardware (subjective)

smaller screen

runs all three major OS (since OS X is already a BSD branch off, I did not add BSD separately)

bluetooth

cons

slower hardrive

smaller screen

[hitest]

Just saw this:

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070...pc-pricing.html

Contrary to earlier reports the Linux PCs are a bit cheaper than the windows PCs.

[hitest]

Wow Dell is expensive, while the base line model looks good I priced out at $1,858

for the following

# 1505N


	Date	 	5/25/2007 10:29:03 AM Central Standard Time
	Catalog Number	 	29 Retail 19
	Catalog Number / Description	 	Product Code	 	SKU	 	Id
	Inspiron E1505:
Intel® Core™ 2 Duo processor T7200 (4MB Cache/2.00GHz/667MHz FSB)	 	KLM2HN	 	[223-0455]	 	1
	Operating System:
Ubuntu Edition version 7.04	 	LINXUX	 	[420-7153]	 	11
	LCD Panel:
15.4 inch UltraSharpâ„¢ Wide Screen SXGA+ Display with TrueLifeâ„¢	 	15SXGAS	 	[320-4652]	 	2
	Memory:
2GB DDR2 SDRAM at 667MHZ, 2 DIMM	 	2G2D6	 	[311-7357]	 	3
	Hard Drive:
100GB 7200rpm SATA Hard Drive	 	100GB72	 	[341-3112]	 	8
	CD ROM/DVD ROM:
8X CD/DVD Burner (DVD+/-RW) with double-layer DVD+R write capability	 	8XLDVDR	 	[313-3959]	 	16
	Video Card:
Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 950	 	INTLVID	 	[320-5630]	 	6
	Sound Options:
Integrated Audio	 	IS	 	[313-4217]	 	17
	Processor Branding:
Intel Centrino Core Duo Processor	 	ICNDNB	 	[310-8314]	 	749
	Primary Battery:
85 WHr 9-cell Lithium Ion Primary Battery	 	9BAT	 	[312-0403]	 	27
	Additional Power Adapter:
Dell Additional Slim 65W Auto/Air/AC Adapter	 	ASAAADT	 	[310-8940]	 	57
	Wireless Networking Cards:
Intel PRO/Wireless 3945a/g	 	IP3945	 	[430-1918]	 	19
	Warranty and Service:
3Yr In-Home Service, Parts + Labor - Next Day	 	SQ3OS	 	[412-0359][950-3339][950-5442][960-2780][960-5952][980-2890][985-3598][985-3609]	 	29
	Protect Against Accidents:
Add CompleteCare Accidental Damage Service to 3Yr Lim Warranty	 	CCADP3	 	[412-0358][960-9188]	 	33
	Environmental Options:
Recycling Kit and Plant a Tree for Me	 	RCLTREE	 	[310-5408][466-1830]	 	129
[\code]


to compare
 $1,800 for an equally equiped Macbook (smaller screen on the macbook, but i like the smaller screen for Airline Travel. )

I only say expensive because the Dell is really cheaply made. I have a Dell laptop D620 and a Macbook and the difference is night and day on quality. plus the Macbook comes with everything I had to add to the dell except the Ram size and the extended Warranty.  Plus with the Macbook you can run OS X, Linux and Windows with the dell its just linux and windows..


macbook specs
[code]
# 2.16GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
# 2GB 667 DDR2 SDRAM - 2x1GB
# 120GB Serial ATA @ 5400 rpm
# SuperDrive 8x (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
# Apple Mini-DVI to DVI Adapter
# Keyboard/Mac OS - U.S. English
# MagSafe Airline Adapter
# AppleCare Protection Plan for MacBook/iBook - Auto-enroll
# AirPort Extreme Card & Bluetooth

while I thank Dell for the offer, I don't think price wise they truly compete.

advantages to the dell

faster harddrive

larger screen

shows a market for Linux

Cons

have to add lots of extras to get a decent sytems

no bluetooth

larger screen

apple pros

the default configuration is decent, same cost to add just ram and Warranty

better quality hardware (subjective)

smaller screen

runs all three major OS (since OS X is already a BSD branch off, I did not add BSD separately)

bluetooth

cons

slower hardrive

smaller screen

Thanks, iccaros!

That is an excellent comparative analysis!